Subject: Collage 410: Unsubscription Fees: The Adventure Drags On Date: 7/26/1999 12:05 PM Received: 7/26/1999 2:12 PM From: HumourNet, humournet-bounces@humournet.com Reply-To: HumourNet Moderator, moderator@humournet.com To: The Internet's Moderated Mailing List for Humour, humournet@lyris.n Collage 410 H u m o u r N e t 26 Jul 1999 Well, it has been several months since I posted Part I of the Unsubscription Fee Collage for 1999; in that time, we've had school children killing school children, bombed the wrong embassy, and learned that Ted is apparently the only Kennedy who floats. It's been a rough quarter, to say the least. Nevertheless, Part I was so tremendously popular that HumourNet's subscription figures increased by at least 500 -- during a period in which there were no postings to the list. I'm not sure if this is good news or bad news. Either way, I can count at least one subscriber who is still a HumourNet member solely because of Collage 409 -- Joyce S. in Lexington, Kentucky: Just wanted you to know that I was going to unsubscribe from the list because -- well, because I'm almost a year behind in reading.... HOWEVER, I received collage #409 today, and opened it to look for the instructions I needed to successfully leave the list ... wouldn't you just KNOW that it's another hilarious unsubscription fee mailing, and a reminder of why I joined the list in the first place (looks like that happened way back in August of '96!) So this is actually a great big thank you note for all of the laughs you've given me. Really. THANKS! p.s I really *am* going to catch up this weekend. I promise... Well heck, if Joyce can catch up this weekend, then so can I. And so, let me introduce: Unsubscription Fees 1999, Part II: "The Adventure Drags On" We kick off Part Deux with a missive from David P. in Wake County, North Carolina, who claims to have filed suit against HumourNet Communications, Ltd.... Please be informed that you are being sued in Wake County, North Carolina Superior Court (when I find it). My phone company (Bell South) recently added to my bill a monthly charge of $1.50. This is my modem line, and the charge is for NOT having a long-distance carrier assigned to that line. Through my extensive research I have determined that they developed this concept by application of your patented "un-subscribe" process. I will email your summons when I receive it. I never did receive a summons from David, who was found floating face-down in the Neuse River a couple of days after he sent me that message. Strange how things like that happen. In case you haven't already noticed, this Collage is dedicated to those who were bright enough to "figure out" the Unsubscription Fee. For example, Jack H., who realized that there's a business plan in _not_ being able to unsubscribe yourself: Vince, Rather silly problem, but I cannot unsub. I am subscribed as .com. My ISP changed all of its user accounts to .net, which is where my mail ends up. My outgoing mail is converted to .net also, which means that Lyris will not allow me to unsubscribe .com. If you would be so kind to help I would appreciate it. And since you would be doing the actual unsubscribing I took the liberty of charging your credit card for the UNsub fee. Thank you for your time and courtesy. Jack H. If Jack thinks that a cheap ploy like that is going to work on THIS kid, I have news for him: I unsubscribed him, and then immediately canceled all my credit cards so he couldn't charge me. So there. Another resourceful HumourNetter is Dale H., who is planning to leverage the concept somewhat: Thanks for your newest HumourNet. I am a subscribing member, but unfortunately I cannot afford to unsubscribe at this time. However, I believe that I have found an easy way to pay for my monthly 29.95 charge for my Internet Access in the boondoggles of Oklahoma: I have decided to charge fees for forwarding, replying, and redirecting messages that come to me. So, if I forward, reply, or redirect 30 messages in one month, the charge for such services would be only one dollar each. Considering that I generally send double that amount, you can see the charge will only be nominal. Again, thanks for the posting of your unsubscribing debacle and if this works out, I hope to be able to unsubscribe in a couple of months. Dale I'm not sure just where Dale sees a profit in that business plan -- but who am I to argue with entrepreneurship? John S., in Seattle, Washington, is another inventive subscriber with a business plan in his pocket ... Subject: Hey, Bucko! Where's My Money? Boy, am I getting sick of your relentless abuse and intimidation of the poor members of the Unaware Masses who try to unsubscribe from your list. You inflict your Unsubscribe Fee on those unsuspecting dopes and always use your worn-out "Read The Welcome Message" excuse ... Okay, since You Obviously Didn't Read It, I will tell you about the text that accompanied my original subscribe message to your list, way back in July 1996 -- just exactly 100 collages ago. That message CLEARLY stated that I charge a $5.00 Mailbox Access Fee for every message sent to my mailbox by any automated listproc, or whatever you insufferable wonkoids call that vaporspace stuff I don't understand at all. And don't give me any guff about an automatic server not being able to read text other than "subscribe" or "unsubscribe." That is obviously YOUR problem, not mine. So. YOU OWE ME FIVE HUNDRED BUCKS. Please send a certified check, in US funds or equivalent, immediately, to: The Merwin P. Sprocket Memorial Level III Recovery Fund c/o Sprocket Mechanical Wooden Cranial Prosthetics Works Six Left Lane East Dented, Minnesota 99899 And no, I will not accept a credit to my White Star Line Frequent Sinker Card. John S. An enterprising youth is Jacob D. in Silver Spring, Maryland, who has found yet ANOTHER business angle on the Unsubscription Fee concept: Vince, Could you sell me 100 unsubcriptions right now at its current price? I expect to make a killing in the unsub futures market when you raise the cost. Thanks, Jacob D. Sorry, Jacob; unfortunately, I'm in business only for myself here. But I have it on very good authority that you will go far in life. Then there are those who are willing to volunteer new business models in the spirit of the Unsubscription Fee. Debra E. in Mountain View, California, has found a way that I can continue collecting bogus fees right on into the next world ... I got the unsubscribe letter, you are evil. ;> You should tell your family to put "A $5 visiting fee has been deducted from your account for visiting this grave." I have to wonder if Debra knows something that I don't know. (?) On a more practical note, Michael C. in Boston, Massachusetts, recommended this approach: Hello, Vince - In response to Collage 388, it seems to me that you're missing a great financial opportunity here. Why not introduce another fee: the Missed Attribution Fee. It could be invoked either (a) whenever someone submits an item which should have been attributed properly (and isn't), or (b) whenever a *reader* fails to notice that a piece should have been otherwise attributed. I suspect that I don't need to point out to you that the real financial possibilities here lie with option (b). However, I must request that as the proposer of said new fee, I be exempt from it. Otherwise I'd be paying through the nose since I *never* notice when a piece should have been otherwise attributed. Mike Personally, I find it annoying when they are willing to come up with these ideas, but are not willing to help foot the bill. *sigh* Even the Web Walker tries to skate on the very fees he is recommending: Hello, Instead of raising the unsubscribe fee, maybe you should consider a Reply-Fee(TM) -- not to be confused with my public service "Reply-Fee-Free" plan. (See judge for details.) Of course, your first instinct is charge me a Reply-Fee(TM) but this would be fruitless because the Reply-Fee(TM) is derived from the "Unsubscription Fee" patent. Therefore you would owe me a royalty payment. When you send a reply explaining, "You clueless idiot! Don't you understand how royalty payments work?" I'll be forced to charge a Reply-Fee(TM). We could settle this like men (i.e., letting our lawyers try to poke each other's eyes out with sharp sticks in front of an Arkansas judge appointed for her knowledge of Presidential staff positions), but I say [...(snipped the rest)] Wilton B. Cupertino, California What I really need, even more than the Reply-Fee, are those who are willing to help cover the rather considerable operating expenses here at HQ HumourNet -- you know, the cost of a telephone line, a modem, the occasional keyboard, and also the HumourNet Mansion in Beverly Hills and the HumourNet Geosynchronous Communications Satellite system that brings you these Collages every few weeks. Or months. You think this is cheap? I need more people like Craig M. in Arizona -- who is quite the honest chap: Dear Vince, I unsubscribed from HumourNet about a month and a half ago. Upon getting my credit card bill yesterday, I noticed that my Humournet unsubscription fee had not been processed. I realize the charge might simply be delayed, but it probably should have shown up by now, and I've had some other problems with my credit card billing so I thought I would ask you what your records show. Sorry for bothering you about this, but my conscience will not allow me to let this mistake go uncorrected. Thank you for your time, and good luck with your list! Craig M. And then there are those who simply aren't satisfied with the current fee structure ... Hi Vince, Since I was changing my subscription and not exactly unsubscribing, I insist that I instead be charged the subscription change fee. Isn't that $10? Furthermore, since I tried not to involve any humans in the process (are there any at HumourNet?), I insist that I also be charged the $0.75 ATM fee. Thanks, Eric L. Thank YOU, Eric. And no, there are no humans at HumourNet; this is actually a top-secret U.S. Government experiment in artificial intelligence -- which, while admittedly artificial, is still more intelligence than you're likely to find anywhere else on the Internet. But Eric is not alone in volunteering new HumourNet fees to help us stay in business; this one is from Kathi R. in response to the "You have unsubscribed from HumourNet and we've charged your credit card for the $5.00 unsubscription fee" message: Thanks, I needed that. When I finish moving and get back on-line you have my permission to charge the same card a $10 re-subscription fee. I'm happy to report that Kathi *is* back on line, and her credit card has been charged accordingly. (Thanks, Kathi! :-) But the coup de grace was from Victoria H.: VH> While I was writing out my check for the unsubscription fee VH> for HumourNet, I realized that there was a problem with VH> that. I mean, suppose I wish to resubscribe? vs: Huh? Resubscribe? BUT WHY? I mean, you finally manage to get vs: OFF the list ... what could possibly possess you to want to vs: get BACK ON? VH> Do I get my fee back? How does that work? vs: You fill out several pages' worth of paperwork, and agree to vs: give us your first-born daughter so she may be sold into vs: slavery, and then we return your $5.00. VH> And suppose I never want to subscribe again? vs: That's pretty much standard. VH> Later, as I was reviewing my credit card statement and saw VH> my annual charges for my right to continue to owe someone VH> else money because I carry a bit of plastic in my purse, I VH> came up with an idea that you may find has some merit: VH> Annual Unsubscription Fees(tm). vs: I like it already. VH> When one unsubscribes from HumourNet, cannot one be VH> resubscribed? vs: It hasn't happened yet ... but it certainly COULD! VH> You have that power, Vince. But, for a tidy sum of say VH> $10.00 per year ($5.00 for senior citizens and children), VH> unsubscription can be made a permanent condition. Otherwise, VH> who knows when collages may start appearing in one's mailbox VH> again? vs: Ooooh, I like it. VH> For those who wish to resubscribe, the fees already paid VH> will be returned to them, less, of course, administrative VH> costs. vs: Which are very high, mind you. VH> I believe this is an idea whose time has come. Anyone with a VH> credit card, bank account, pension plan, stock options, VH> social security benefits, welfare stipend, or weekly VH> allowance can more than afford to curtail the appearance of VH> HumourNet in their mailbox by paying an annual fee. Will VH> they miss the 5 or 10 dollars from those accounts? Possibly. VH> But what is that in exchange for the continued right to VH> never have to view another collage? vs: DAMNED STRAIGHT! VH> Those who wish to stop the insidious fees need only to VH> resubscribe and they will receive a 100% refund, less, of VH> course, administrative costs. Can anything be fairer? vs: Sure -- but who cares? This is HumourNet! We don't care vs: about fair, we Just Want The Money. I love it; expect to see Annual Unsubscription Fees worked into the basic fee HumourNet structure sometime in the near future. And speaking of annual fees and communications satellites (we were speaking of them several paragraphs back; it's a segue, deal with it), Tyrrell B. had me pretty well cornered with this one: TB> So I'm curious as to how you checked my geographical TB> location. Does the Iridium low earth orbit satellite system TB> allow commercial use of its mapping location responders? vs: Shhhhh! We hacked the entire constellation. :-) TB> I could be impressed, but then there is this US$5.00 charge TB> to be discussed. I must say you are a scoundrel with no TB> remorse for the little people. vs: Your point? TB> Therefore, I have cut up my credit card, so you will not be TB> able to process this charge. DRAT! Foiled again. But at least Tyrrell realized that I wasn't fabricating this stuff -- as if anyone could. Some are not so sure, though ... like Sharilyn L. in Lake Mathews, California: Oh this stuff is hilarious. But please, please, please tell me that you wrote it all yourself. It pains me to think these folks actually inhabit the same world as I (although it would explain a lot). If this collage is true, can you tell me where to pay my unsubscription fee to planet Earth? TIA I've received several "Stop the Earth, I want to get off" messages in response to my Unsubscription Fee Collages. The stark reality of a world inhabited by people who are capable of falling for the Unsub Fee is surprising to many -- such as Trish S. in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania: Vince -- Oh that was good. I do enjoy your commentary, but I was shocked to find that there are so many humor impaired people in this world. Maybe you should develop (and patent) a "humor detection test" that potential subscribers would have to pass BEFORE they would be allowed to receive postings from the list! Keep up the good work! Trish I'd gladly develop such a test -- but I'd have to subscribe them first, so that I could collect the Unsubscription Fees if they didn't pass. I might even have to charge an additional Failure Fee. This could really be my ticket to early retirement. Speaking of tests, the following suggestion from Bernard L. in Omaha, Nebraska, might not help me reach early retirement any sooner -- but it would certainly help make the world a better and more enjoyable place for The Rest Of Us: Vince, Thank you for your contributions to the greater well being of all society! I think that a list of all the folks who unsubscribe from HumourNet and manage to not *get* it should be compiled and kept in a secret place. The list should then be used to identify people applying for or attempting to do any of the following: 1) Bear children 2) Obtain a drivers license 3) Run for public office 4) Actually, anything that requires contact with other humans. Anyone on the list found to be attempting any of the above would be banned from doing those things and quietly whisked away to a comfortable, quiet room. Soon, with such a list in use, the world would begin to be brighter, the left lane on the interstate would clear, and stupidity in general would ebb. The sooner we gather the list, the better. Thanks again. -- Bernard L I like it. And no, it's not Naziism; it's simply protecting The Rest Of Us from the Intellectual Proletariat(tm). We're not trying to create the perfect society; merely a slightly more tolerable society. I was also very amused by those who realized, right from the outset, that the easiest way to deal with the Unsubscription Fee was simply to get it out of the way right up front: MS> Hi. Thanks to Ray's (joke-a-day) adding a link to your MS> unsubscription fees page, I have very happily wasted 2 hours MS> reading through your pages. (Okay, so he's a slow reader.) MS> I like it so much I joined up. As for the unsubscribe MS> fee, please accept my US$5 in advance. :) vs: YES! Finally, someone who is smart enough to realize, right vs: from the start, that he won't want to be sticking around for vs: long. Chad B. in Burlington, Indiana, also realized that he wouldn't be able to put up with us for very long: After reading collage 375, I knew I had to subscribe to HumourNet. One question, however: Would it be possible to have you charge the unsubscribe fee to my credit card now? That way I won't have to remember it and have an unexpected charge on my credit card later. Thanks for your help ;) Similarly amusing are those who finally figured it out -- but almost DIDN'T! Numbering among the Recently Enlightened is Jeff M. in Lakewood, Colorado, seen here responding to the Official HumourNet Unsubscription Message: hn: We have checked your geographical location, and it hn: corresponds to an unsubscription fee of US$5.00. Your credit hn: card will be charged the appropriate amount. JM> You are more than welcome to charge any card number you want JM> with a $5.00 fee. I never gave you a card number. If you can JM> find it on your own, knock yourself out. Charge away. JM> Cheers! ;-) hn: HumourNet: hn: Anyone Without a Sense of Humor Is At The Mercy of hn: The Rest of Us JM> Oh. I get it. A little slow on the uptake, but gets there eventually. Another member of the Recently Enlightened is Ezra R. in Reno, Nevada: You got me! I unsubscribed myself (only to resubscribe my new address) and I got the confirmation with the unsub fee notice. I about hit the roof before I remembered the old scandal. Than I laughed my a** off. Thanks for a good prank! :) You're more than welcome, Ezra; thank you for restoring our faith in humanity -- tenuous as it is. Unfortunately, Jonathan P. in Arkansas took a little longer to reach the illumination point: To Whom This May Concern, I do not know the meaning of this? When I subscribed there was no mention of an unsubscription rate. I have not included any information concerning a credit card. And there is no indication of my geographical location, what geographical locations have rates. Please send me documentation concerning this. Thank you, Jonathan And then, several hours later ... I apoligize for the above posting. I found the welcome message and read the warning that you put on there. I guess I kind of freaked out. It seemed odd to me and I've been working on getting myself unsubscribed from the thousands of lists that I'm on. Needless, to say, yours has been the easiest (sad, isn't it!) Thanks, Jonathan We'll put this one down as a near miss. :-) And speaking of near misses, the most amusing misses of all are the ones that elude even the perpetrator of the Unsubscription Fee, himself. Enter my favorite subscriber for 1999, Tracy S. of the National Institute of Standards and Technology in Gaithersburg, Maryland: Vince- I recently unsubscribed to HumourNet and I received an email saying that my credit card will be charged a $5.00 unsubscription fee. I did not receive notification of this fee when I joined the list, and wouldn't have joined if that was the case. I have not given you my credit card number, or authorization to charge to it at any time. I haven't had time to read the postings for a year now and decided to save your server the trouble of sending to me when I can't read them, but if you insist on charging for unsubscribing then continue my subscription and I'll just keep throwing them away. It's up to you. Tracy S. I love it when I know I've snared another one. Time to move in for the kill ... Hi Tracy, If we did not have a credit card number for you on file, then the server probably forwarded the charge to your ISP. In your case, that would be the Purchasing Dept. at NIST. You might want to contact them to discuss the bill. Also, please note that we moved to a new server in August, and sent out a new Welcome message at that time. The new Welcome message contained the instructions for unsubscribing from the list, AS WELL AS all of the information on list policy and fees. I can send you a copy of that message if you would like. At this point, the charge is not reversible unless you can get your Purchasing Dept to return it to me; I can then add you back onto the list so that you may continue receiving list postings. Let me know how you wish to proceed. - Vince Unfortunately, I quickly realized that Tracy was not the one who'd been trapped: Vince- Since it's a joke, let it go through my Purchasing Dept. It's your tax dollars hard at work. LOL!!! Gotcha too!! Bye!! -Tracy DAMN! I'd been nailed at my own game -- a fact that, I have to admit, really did have me laughing out loud: LMAO! Yes, you got me. But it's not fair to entrap the moderator! Good job, Tracy. :-) Take care ... - Vince Of course, I get to post this to my Unsubscription Fee Collage, so I still manage to win. I think. Somehow, the list owner ALWAYS wins. Speaking of the list owner always winning, you'll enjoy this one from Dan R. in Blacksburg, Virginia: One of my professors at Virginia Tech says that several years ago he was somehow subscribed to a mailing list that he never desired to join. He made several requests to the list owner that he be removed, but the list owner denied that he was subscribed in the first place. After enduring this literally for years, my professor learned that the Virginia legislature was going to pass a law stating that if someone requests to be unsubscribed from an e-mail list and his request is not granted, he may sue the list owner for $500. Dr. Lee sent notice of this new law to the owner of the still offending mailing list. The list owner replied, "So? We're based in Toronto." Obviously, we have to get the U.N. to put a stop to these madcap list owners. On the subject of list ownership, one of the things that I find somewhat amusing (even endearing) about all of this is the number of people who correspond with me solely to snag a spot in a HumourNet Collage (and yes, I do appreciate it when you put your city and state (or country) in your signature). Sylvia L. in the U.K. presents a classic case of a message intended solely for the Unsubscription Fee Collage -- and it's simply too amusing to pass up: Submission fees? Pardon? What submission fees? I was not told of any submission fees in advance. And don't tell ME to read your little submission guidelines! I never got any. I tried. I sent the blank email as requested to wherever it was it said and -- nothing. I waited several days, and nothing! No submission guidelines. No hint about submission fees. Now, ordinarily, I'd say, I want my contribution back and you can forget the submission fee. But knowing what kind of slimy slug you are, you probably have an un-submission fee too. Now I am forced to wait (years probably, knowing how slow you are!) to see if my submission is accepted. I live in horror waiting to see if the rejection fee is worse than the acceptance fee. In closing, I would just like to point out that when you wind stupid gullible people up with threats of $5 unsubscription fees, then that is funny. When you threaten *ME* with 50c of submission fees, it is not funny. Got that? Others - funny. Me - NOT funny. OK? :-) Sylvia But what's even more amusing is when someone who writes to me does NOT want to appear in a HumourNet Collage. For example, when Maureen M. in Arkansas wrote to ask a favor of me, she included this in her reply to my message... MM> Thank you thank you thank you MM> (kissing your ring) MM> I hope I am being sufficiently polite and appreciative. Any MM> excess is a blatant attempt to remain in your good graces in MM> order to keep any mention of my name or our conversations MM> out of future collages. I must really get some sleep now, I MM> have been staying quite late at night trying to figure out MM> proper phrasing for each of these letters, so as to leave MM> you the least amount of ammunition possible. I will, MM> however, visit the local court house to initiate proceedings MM> on a name change just in case you manage to pick up on MM> something I have missed. MM> with much appreciation, MM> the former Maureen Clearly, there's more than one sleazy-yet-successful way to get your name into an Unsubscription Fee Collage. But despite all of the witty, clever, creative, inventive, amusing, entrepreneurial, or downright sleazy methods of getting your name up in cyber-lights, the one who always goes home with the award is the one who's just too goshdarned cute. Even *I* couldn't mess with this poor little girl's mind when she wrote to me in response to the unsubscription message: MD> do not charge me. i will stay on, if you dont charge me. MD> this is not my credit card, its my father's and he will MD> freak. please... vs: Normally, I'd have some fun with a message like this ... but vs: since I'm feeling very charitable tonight , I'll simply vs: mention that there is no "fee" -- it's just a joke. vs: So, no need to stay on the list, and Dad's credit card isn't vs: going to be charged for anything. Unless I really *REALLY* vs: need a new modem ... ;-) Randy Cassingham, editor of "This is True" and the new "Heroic Stories" mailing list , thought that I went too easy on her: RC> What a SOFTIE! Wow, Vince, you're really mellowing with age! vs: I know. *sigh* I could have had the little tyke crying in vs: her morning cereal, begging forgiveness from Dad for vs: something that was never going to happen. I could have vs: ruined her for life, put her in psychotherapy until she was vs: old enough to collect Social Security ... vs: [!] vs: Damn, where did I put her message ... ? Of course, no Unsubscription Fee Collage would be complete without the annual fund raising drive for The Seeing Eye in Morristown, New Jersey -- and the following message provides the ideal lead-in: Jeez, Vince, I love HumourNet and the mailing list, but your unsub fee is SUCH a good idea that I find myself wanting to unsub just so I can assure you that the check is (really ... would this face lie?) in the mail. What's a girl to do? Well, you can always contribute to The Seeing Eye. TSE trains dog guides (yes, Walt, I got it right this time) for the blind, and has been HumourNet's beneficiary for several years running now. If you appreciate all of the work that goes into providing you with humour four times a year ;-), then please consider a contribution to The Seeing Eye -- or any dog-guide training center of your choice. Contributions to TSE can be sent to: The Seeing Eye, Inc. ATTN: Rosemary Carroll Washington Valley Road Morristown NJ USA 07960 Be sure to state that the contribution is in the name of "HumourNet Communications, Ltd," or else we won't acquire points toward a free dog. (Okay, I'm kidding about the free dog. ;-) You can visit TSE's home page at . And finally, we hear from Maureen M. in Arkansas, who apparently decided to hedge her bets on making a debut in a HumourNet Collage with this message ... Subject: YOU HAVE BEEN QUOTED MM> I found a definite need to quote you today ... hope you MM> don't mind. The following text is from a conversation MM> between games at a Scrabble site. My comments are preceded MM> with "MM>" and the rest are from some unfortunate soul who MM> shall remain nameless... US> I was just wondering what everyones' strategy was whenever US> they have a rack full of vowels? Is it better to exchange US> and not get any points or should you try to make a play and US> get rid of some vowels hoping to pick up some good letters US> in your pick up? Just curious as to how others handle a rack US> full of vowels. MM> I usually cuss a little and throw a few things... then I MM> hack into the server and see if I can trade a few of them MM> with one of the games where I have a whole rack full of MM> consonants US> Isn't it illegal to exchange letters from one game to the US> next? MM> SIGH.... MM> "Those without a sense of humor are at the mercy of the rest MM> of us." -- Vince Sabio Indeed. - Vince Sabio HumourNet Moderator moderator@humournet.com ____________________________________________________________________ Opener (above) Copyright 1999 by Vincent Sabio Permission is hereby granted to forward or post this "Collage"; please observe the guidelines stated at the end of the message. ____________________________________________________________________ For those of you who are new to HumourNet, note that this is not our standard format for mailings to this list. OTOH, since I seem to be sending out a Collage every few months now, I'm not sure exactly WHAT our standard format is, other than long periods of dead air. ;-) ******************************************************************** Anyone without a sense of humor is at the mercy of the rest of us. ******************************************************************** HumourNet is brought to you by "Lyris" -- an innovative list server from Lyris Technologies, Inc.: . HumourNet's Web and FTP sites are hosted by gamerz.net: . The HumourNet mailing list, Web site, and archives are completely free of advertising, and are funded through sales of "SmartBounce," our industry-standard bounce handler for mailing lists. If you run a mailing list, and have a problem with mail bounces, then you might need SmartBounce: . 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